I know I've spouted this shit before but I'm in the mood to regurgitate it now that I can actually do so without it getting deleted.
Why is it that women get to certain ranks in MAs and then leave? WTF!? How do you train for 10 or more years, get your black belt then dodge out? What you think you've figured it all out? You've learned everything there is to know? Or is it your intentions weren't about defending your life or your family but merely as a social experience or to bag a man/husband? Not that I know any of those personally, no of course not, I'm just asking.
I have three kids, working and going to school. The last semester I haven't been around the studio to train at all but I can't stay away. I have to go by and say hi and keep in touch. These others? You don't see them. You don't hear from them. Nothing. I came up with a group of at LEAST 10 other women. Most of us got our Black Belts yet I'm the ONLY one still storming the mats (I mean storming in the best of ways here). How is it I can find the time with all I have going on and the others can't? Again I ask what are most women's motives for training in a MA? Are they looking for themselves or someone else?
I guess I shouldn't give a shit but it does bother me when I know that we're the gender that will most LIKELY need this stuff, so why aren't there more of us a) there and b) STAYING there?! It's incredible. Last I checked guys don't get raped and attacked or beaten. WOMEN do. So why aren't the other 10 still storming the mats? And no they aren't training anywhere else, I would know that. A good part of them never even stuck around to get their black belt.
Then I think back about the Kenponet and how I was "received" on that forum and you have to wonder if the correlation there is the same on the mats and although I don't get that per se at my studio, I know that it exists. Men either don't want women around on the mats or the ones that they are fine with on the mats they relate in some way to themselves, meaning, we're like them we're still not female. Interesting no? If you doubt it think about your interactions with the women at your studio and see where it fits. Some maybe on the line. Part of you think yea it's ok she's here as long as she isn't in "my way" and the other part is like, "Oh her!? She's not a woman she's one of us!" I hear that second one ALL the time. Hell I hear it with the race card let alone the gender one...hahaha. Alot of times people are surprised I'm Black, but I'll save that one for another forum and/or another rant.
Right now lets keep it Kenpo/MA. Ultimately there seems to be a general consensus that women can't hack it in MAs and if they can by some reason that certainly doesn't make them an authority on the subject. It's a fluke, so to listen to any of your input would be utter nonsense or they'll placate you until they find a way to shut you up. Did I mention Kenponet? I meant to.
Hey listen no one knows better than I that life gets in the way but there are times you have to stare life in the eye and tell it to go fuck itself. Particularly when it comes to defending yourself and perhaps your kids if need be or better yet if it comes to doing something you REALLY like and enjoy.
I just can't think of anything that would take me away (permanently anyway) from training after all the time I've put into it at this point. Hiatuses here and there absolutely. Sometimes your body and your mind need the rest and the recovery time but to just give up and stop completely?!?
Never! Ain't gonna happen noway no how. I've learned way more about myself through MA than through ANY other thing I've done to date. My kids and school are a close second but that's still not as introspective as Kenpo has been believe it or not.
So to all you women that started out MA training and left for any reason at all, I say come back. You probably stopped for ALL the wrong reasons. There isn't a man out there big enough or bad enough, hot enough or rich enough to keep me out of the studio. If I stopped today, I can say unequivocally that I would be doing myself and my spirit a great disservice.
Get back on the mats. You'll be glad you did!
Excellent article Angel,
I would however like to ask you NOT to save that rant for another forum;
I'm genuinely interested in your thoughts on race in the martial arts.
Could be a very cool topic.
On a side note (a piece of what you touched on);
I work with quite a few females myself at Bill's school, his daughter being one of them, and I find I am guilty of #2 constantly.
I see them as 'one of the guys'. I never stopped to think how alienating that could be. Do you find that it is in any way detrimental to your identity as a female?
It surely isn't done (at least on my part) to be hurtful or mean to the females in the school,
it is just a natural reaction when you see a female straight take someone 100 pounds heavier, male, and physically stronger, to school and beat them around the mat like a play toy.
I wonder how I should act? What do you think would be the correct thing to do?
Genuinely Interested,
Me.
Honestly,
Being such a tomboy all my life I don't know any other attitude from guys, so I'm personally not offended but it'd be nice to see all women be treated the same way on the mats. Meaning, don't treat other women softer than you would treat me just because you consider me one of the guys, then tee off on my ass...hahaha. I get that a lot too. They see them as "more female" than I am...go fig.
Most of the time you'll see it when there are affairs outside of the studio and we're all out and I walk into a room in a dress or if I come in from work the looks are like, "Whoa that's right. We forgot....you're a chick!" looks. OK maybe there are some leers too..haha..but those are ok within reason.
I don't think there is anything that you should do differently as long as you aren't being soft on one set of women as opposed to the ones you think are the cool chicks. You aren't doing the "soft ones" any good by holding back on them. They are the ones that will more aptly be the victim as the stronger types on attitude alone will more than likely thwart off a situation because they know that they aren't the ones!
As long as you're aware you're doing it you'll probably see that you'll make certain changes on your own. It's really up to the individual female I would guess.
You'll know what to do.
Excellent advice. Very much appreciated.
Angela, my wife and both of my daughters are training twicw a week. My oldest daughter is in her 6th year as a blue belt and my Wife also is 6years into her orange belt.
Where I work out, there has always been a focus on making sure the girls beat the boys in fighting. Once the girls know they can hit without getting into trouble they always kick the boys butts. I also wish they would continue to excel in kenpo, but I am not their parents.
My Wife has watched and trained kenpo for 16 years now. Her dedication to kenpo has always been tremendous. I personally think that a family should train together. Money aside, we as BB's can only do our communities good when we show Women/girls that they can defend themselves with the abilities and skills that you I and other BB's can give them.
THree teenage Women went to BB four years ago where I work out. One enlisted to the army on Septemeber 10th, 2001, and the other two moved away. One warrior, and to ninjas I guess.
Clark
Awesome!
That's the way it should be. Empower them as much as possible because again....we're the ones that will need it most.
Good work :)
OHHHMYYYGODDDD!!!! I didn't know you were Black????? Just kidding, LOL.... Please don't hurt me!!!!
I found that most women I have encountered in training have that "Get Married and Live Happily Ever After" approach to the Martial Arts. They set out to prove something to themselves because of abusive relationships, Men or women issues depending on sexual orientation or just self esteem issues in general.... The coveted Black Belt seem's an almost impossible dream to attain for most people anyway so plans for the "Happily Ever After" part might not be planned.
The women I have known also find that most guys don't want to go out with someone who can kick their ass!!!! My sister is a Medical Doctor and had trouble finding guys to date because of the intimidation factor because guys don't want to feel stupid even if they are.... she finally started saying she owned a body shop!!! The obvious then follows that you can't find anybody to date and therefore only associate with people at your school, develope relationships, break up then don't want to train anymore.
I have also have had women tell me that "You Don't Have to Worry About Getting Raped" stereotypical Bull Shit.... I work in a Maximum Security Prison.... I assure you The thought crosses my mind many times a day.... not that I am lonely, just concerned about keeping my Virgianal status!!!
Anyhow, thats just my my Macho, Red Neck, Chauvinistic, Latent Homophobic, Different slant on the same perspective... just like my butt opinion.... void where prohibited by law.
Aloha,
Rich
Great response, Rich,
I agree entirely. I think that most women go through LIFE with the Happily Ever After frame of mind. It's just kind of the way society has conditioned us to think even though we know deep inside that alot of us are quite happy on our own.
As for the can't find a man that appreciates a woman that can take care of herself you got that right. Another thing that could scare them off as they progress they realize that men become intimidated by the fact they don't necessarily "need them" if the crap hits the fan. Thing is if I have a man by my side I just soon he takes care of the fan situation. Again, I'm not training MA so that I can go toe to toe with some guy. WTF!? Even with a black belt and some red stripes on it I'm still female and he's still a guy. What are my odds of winding up the one hurt? Pretty high. The way I see it I'm there as back up for my man if he needs help...hahaha.
But being that I am single, then yes, there are things I have to train differently and coming from a different place because I will more than likely be alone when something ugly goes down.
As for that maximum security prison thing....YIPES! Keep safe and your back to the wall.
Thanks for the input.
Hi Angela. Long time no see.
I have a reflection on your insight to this. As a guy and an instructor/school owner.
I think most of the time, people will set the distance and intensity of their own training. I have guys who can't take a punch and who hate to spar. I try to take them out of their comfort zone and for some it is a long process.
We have several women in my school that are on both sides of the "How they are treated fence". We have my daughter, Camey, along with a White belt, Susan, who do not shy away from the training or the love of the art. All of them are ladies.
Most every guy has a story of all three of these women "whacking them". They are treated different from the moms who want to just come in and have something in common with their little Bobby.
Treated different not by OUR choice but by THEIR actions. I do agree that it is easy to treat them bangers as "one of the guys". But what other reference point do we have.
f they share my passion, want to REALLY learn how to defend themselves against "inbred idiots", then I can relate to them alot more than the lady that comes in to train with her kid and says, "Watch it guys I just got my nails done" and fades away when you go to grab them.
I don't think it is sexist or anything. I think it is natural for people to lump others into one of two groups, your inner circle and everyone else (including women). Not politically correct but true.
Hi Angela! Like you, I am treated like one of the guys. I have also always been a "tomboy" and get the comments when coming into the school from work or going out as a group and I’m not in my “pajamas”. LOL
I can tell you why I almost left Kenpo….
I LOVE Kenpo but I almost left due to comments from people in the school. Because I am friendly with the guys, I have heard that I am a flirt or I'm after their husband, etc....
I was going through a separation (now a divorce) and I have heard go home to your husband or your kid’s need you at home. If I was a man, it would have been, oh, had to get away from the “old lady” or some other dude-like comment. What my kids needed was for me to be happy and Kenpo does that for me. As far as the husband thing, Kenpo or no Kenpo, we would have gone down this path somewhere down the line. But these remarks made me feel guilty. Then I made a conscious decision to not care what anyone has to say and I am glad I did. All I want to do is train!
I have also heard things at work like, why would you want to do something so violent? (Hmmm… maybe because it could save my life and I do live in Philadelphia, not the safest city around). It just goes back to girls should wear pink and play with baby dolls. That is why most women feel like they don’t have a right to protect themselves and fall victim to crime.
I also tend to bruise easily and I train with intensity so sometimes I look like a battered woman and I get comments and stares. I had my rib broken in class and my then-husband was questioned by the police to see if I was being abused. I don’t know about other MA and their retention rate for women but Kenpo is hard on the body and most women don’t want to walk around with bruises all over them. (On another note, I think it is funny when you go to a seminar and at the dinner banquette you see all the women dressed up and showing off their bruises like in Lethal Weapon). What I love to hear the most is when a woman takes some time off to have a baby and then uses the excuse; I can’t go back until I am in shape. Hell, what better way to get your ass back into shape!
Another problem that I have is some men at our dojo do not like to hit a woman. If I am not attacked aggressively in a safe atmosphere, then how will I be able to defend myself on the streets? The days that are like this, I get bored. I feel like why bother coming; I’m not getting anything out of this. I have taken a new direction on this as well. Either I step up and just start whacking my attacker until he gets it or I help out my instructor. No better way to learn than to teach.
It sure would be nice to have more women reach BB and continue with their training. Just keep doing what you do and set the example. I have told you before, when I saw you beating on David when I was a purple belt, I knew that this art was for me and I wanted to move like you.
Getting back to the mats!
Carrie Yaffe
Carrie,
You just made my night. God bless ya for hanging in there, booting the guys that patronized you and for doing what makes YOU happy. You have just won half the battle.
Anytime I can help you with anything you know where to find me.
Keep trainin and trainin hard....you can accomplish anything. Main thing be true to yourself and your training as the rest will work itself out over time.
Hi Angela and everyone reading,
Great comments and I concur that more women should join the MAs.
I do not truly know how I am perceived at my school, as I never really cared. I never let others' opinions dictate my life. Yes, sometimes you hear the comments and they may hurt, but I just move on very quickly. That is how I have always survived whether it be family, friends or acquaintances. Do what makes you happy; you have to live with
yourself and your choices in life.
I know that I do favor more male dominated sports: SCUBA diving, Kenpo, working
out at the gym, fishing, cars, dogs, now motorcycles, and any challenging sport. I like to
get hit hard at Kenpo and that is fine. I have a high threshold for pain, so the hits do not bother me. My body has adjusted to the hits, and I simply do not bruise much anymore.
I too have often wondered what people were saying behind my backs, and sometimes
I would hear a snide remark. For the most part, I ignored it. I guess because I do not
really care, I have not taken notice to many comments about me. My point, who cares
if Kenpo or anything else you do is a “male” dominated sport, just do it and have FUN.
Moreover, you are helping yourself physically and mentally.
I joined karate because I was mugged three times and physically beaten by my ex-husband some 16 years ago. Many do not know this, but I guess now you do!
Kenpo has liberated me with the knowledge that “I am safe”. If no one else
can help me, I can help myself. That is the only profound thing that is relevant to me.
Yes, many other intrinsic things have happened to me due to Kenpo, but I am most thankful for the safety aspects that Kenpo has afforded me.
I have learned that my sister fears me now, guys I date do not take my art seriously, and
my dogs know who’s the boss. I laugh and tell my sister, one day this may
save you/us and your kids. To the men I date, I tell them to grab at me and then
I “show” them and laugh. My dogs, well they are just my babies, but I am still Alpha.
I did not want to make this long, but Kenpo is awesome and I love the art and the comradery that comes with it. I am happy that I have met everyone thus far and hope to meet more of you Kenpoists out there. So to the ladies, come join us. We will welcome you with open arms.
I would like to apologize for the format of the previous reply. The formatting is off, because I typed it in Word and copied it into this layout. Sorry for the mess, but this box needs to be wider. LOL
Annette Garberina
Annette,
Thanks for your reply. I as you know by now feel much the same way. This can only make you stronger in spirit and attitude and most women will need that in the world we find ourselves living in. Robert and I talk alot about real life being some of the toughest challenges I'll face and that most of my "fights" are off the mats not on them.
If it weren't for Kenpo I don't know that I would have made it through the divorce, being let go from a job that didn't appreciate the work I was putting in all the while the "friends" that I suggested work there are still there and never called once since I was terminated.
So when I get on the mats I feel like that's my time to be me. It's my time to prove what I'm made of no matter what society thinks, an employer, "friends", an ex husband or anyone else that may have given me static. Women need a place to feel empowered when you're living in a relatively man's world and know that we have to fight harder to be taken seriously, be heard, or make a difference.
Kenpo gives me the strength to be stronger in mind, body and spirit and allows me to feel empowered in a way I may not feel otherwise.
Who could walk away from that?